Discussion Forum - Northstar Chevelle Club

SShink · 3K+ Club

Did a bad thing... found LS1Tech!

SteveS · Super Poster

You wouldn't regret it Stan. I really enjoy driving mine now. There are lots and lots of options for motor mounts, oil pans, etc. I reworked my own harness, they aren't as bad as they look. Turn the key and go!

-- Edited by SteveS on Tuesday 20th of September 2011 12:10:37 PM

dashboard · 2K+ Club

I am going to completely resist the urge to open the link to that site, completely resist. Not going there, going to force myself not to even peek at the LS thing site.

Think a guy could put a new Kessler RS 500 five speed overdrive behind one of those LS deals?

Enganeer · Mega Poster

I just started tearing down my Elky Sunday night for the LS1/T56 this winter.

So far the front clip is off and I am ready to pull the engine / transmission.

I'll post pics along the way.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Enganeer wrote:
I just started tearing down my Elky Sunday night for the LS1/T56 this winter.

So far the front clip is off and I am ready to pull the engine / transmission.

I'll post pics along the way.

Please start a thread so that we can learn from you!

One of my 'unkowns' is what tank to use for the electric fuel pump that looks stock without having to modify it with a sump. I saw a few things on LS1tech.com in regards to solutions for that.

Enganeer · Mega Poster

Kevin,

You can put one of those transmission behind an LS engine. Though I would go with a T56 myself from an LS1 f-body.

http://www.keislerauto.com/gm/gm-parts-and-accessories/bellhousings/chevrolet-super-duty-11-bellhousing-only-late-model-ls/shop.flypage_acc.html

Go on and peek inside LS1tech, it's free...

-- Edited by Enganeer on Tuesday 20th of September 2011 12:48:47 PM

67ss · 1K+ Club

You can keep your 200-4r and put an ls motor in front of it. No need to sell off the transmission you just spent all that money on.

SShink · 3K+ Club

67ss wrote:
You can keep your 200-4r and put an ls motor in front of it. No need to sell off the transmission you just spent all that money on.

I thought about that, but also thought that with all the electronic controls of a 4L60E, it might be a nice combo to be able to tweak shift points, adjust for tire size, etc. Or, if I find 5.3 litre engine with the trans, it might be a better deal overall.

That's the fun part about a project like this... thinking of all the options.

Enganeer · Mega Poster

I am sure Derek has many answers already. The B-body tank comes to mind with a little trimming of the frame.

My donor car was a Camaro and the fuel tank is a side fill just like the elky . I just need to see how the tank mounts underneath in regards to depth (hanging down too far). Width wise, it looks ok.

Derek69SS · Founding Member

In your shoes, I'd go with the Spectra tank... perfect for a mild street car that's not going to be roadracing or needing to feed 600hp.

I'd also stick with the 200-4R for its gear ratios which are WAY better than the 4L60e.

Enganeer · Mega Poster

Best way is to find a donor vehicle, preferably 2wd or F-body. Strip off everything you think you could possibly use and bag and tag. This way, your not chasing down little parts.

I found a ls1 camaro and stripped it bare. Sold off what I did not think I would use to recoupe some money.

This is what I was after

If I had room, I would pick a later 3500 series van from a salvage auction. Here is one from a charity auction that ends Wednesday. 6 liter, 4l80E transmission, computer, harness, fuel system, etc. Not bad starting point

http://www.charitycarauctions.com/cgi-bin/mnlist.cgi?charitycar2/63970M

(fixed link)

-- Edited by Enganeer on Tuesday 20th of September 2011 01:39:28 PM

67ss · 1K+ Club

Derek69SS wrote:

I'd also stick with the 200-4R for its gear ratios which are WAY better than the 4L60e.

There is a company now making a new gear cluster for the 700r4 so first gear is 2.84 I think but they are not cheap.

http://www.transmissioncenter.net/highperf700r4.htm#Parts

Scroll down about 1/2 way and it talks all about them.

jim larson · 2K+ Club

No cold start or carb issues here and around 15mps. Thought we had close to the same thing. Good luck, should keep you busy.

SteveS · Super Poster

The spectra tank at Rock auto is the cheapest, they are supposed to have reworked it to stop the fuel starvation issues they had. First gear in the 4L60e is too low, but I do like all the changes that can be made with the computer. If I were to do it again, I'd go T-56.

SShink · 3K+ Club

jim larson wrote:
No cold start or carb issues here and around 15mps. Thought we had close to the same thing. Good luck, should keep you busy.

I've got 4.11 gears, so even with the 0.67 overdrive I'm running at 2400 rpm at 65 mph and only getting 10-11 mpg. That works well with the 2400 stall converter, but not what I was hoping for.

A 3.73 gear would probably be just right.

dashboard · 2K+ Club

Ok thats enough, now get back to work guys!

John D · 2K+ Club

Why in the "Aich E Double Hockey Sticks" did you put this on here!!

Now you've got me thinking again...

(Yeah, I'm about 10 or so years "behind the curve" with the LT-1/4L60, but...)

Frankly, I'd stay away from ANY "Fleet Vehicles" that are on auctions. As the driver of said, we're on a 5000 mile oil change interval, only authorized to use conventional (dinosaur sauce) oil, the hood ONLY opened to top off wiper juice, and you think that people beat on rental cars??? Try a company truck - they're run at capacity or overloaded 90% of their life. The only fleet truck I'd consider is a low mileage, rear-end wreck, or a "boss's/supervisor's" pickup.

Enganeer · Mega Poster

Added a new post for my LS1 conversion start.

Lost in the 60s · President

SShink wrote:
I've got 4.11 gears, so even with the 0.67 overdrive I'm running at 2400 rpm at 65 mph and only getting 10-11 mpg. That works well with the 2400 stall converter, but not what I was hoping for.
A 3.73 gear would probably be just right.
You should be doing better than 10-11 mpg with the current setup. Is your speedo reading correctly ? Just change the gears and see how it is. Much cheaper than an LS1 swap.
If you truely take the LS route, an aftermarket tank built for a stock GM pump is the way to go. Install the corvette filter/regulator at the back and you don't need a return line. I did this on a Camaro last year and it was a simple swap. The owner opted for a stainless tank from Rick's.
Oh, and put me first on the engine buyer list !!

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
SShink wrote:
I've got 4.11 gears, so even with the 0.67 overdrive I'm running at 2400 rpm at 65 mph and only getting 10-11 mpg. That works well with the 2400 stall converter, but not what I was hoping for.
A 3.73 gear would probably be just right.
You should be doing better than 10-11 mpg with the current setup. Is your speedo reading correctly ? Just change the gears and see how it is. Much cheaper than an LS1 swap.
Oh, and put me first on the engine buyer list !!

Speedo is spot on. I added an adaptor from the speedo shop guy in Bloomington that Master Trans sent me to, and it adjusted everthing perfectly. Speedo/Odometer match exactly with GPS.

I was hoping for around 14-15 mpg, but not even close. I just swapped on a new carb hoping that helps as I got tired of messing with jets. Haven't checked the mileage yet.

You have first right of refusal if I decide to sell the 402...

Lost in the 60s · President

Did you go to an Edelbrock carb ? I have one on the Camaro and really like it. I was a die-hard Holley man until then. The Chevelle has a Holley and it seems to do well but no fuel gauge to check mileage.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
Did you go to an Edelbrock carb ? I have one on the Camaro and really like it. I was a die-hard Holley man until then. The Chevelle has a Holley and it seems to do well but no fuel gauge to check mileage.

Yep, Edelbrock 750 cfm w/vaccum secondaries.

BB502 · Active Member

Stan, If you decide to sell the tranny and go with the newer one I would be interested in the 200r4.

SShink · 3K+ Club

BB502 wrote:
Stan, If you decide to sell the tranny and go with the newer one I would be interested in the 200r4.

Got it. I'll keep you posted.

dashboard · 2K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
SShink wrote:
I've got 4.11 gears, so even with the 0.67 overdrive I'm running at 2400 rpm at 65 mph and only getting 10-11 mpg. That works well with the 2400 stall converter, but not what I was hoping for.
A 3.73 gear would probably be just right.
You should be doing better than 10-11 mpg with the current setup. Is your speedo reading correctly ? Just change the gears and see how it is. Much cheaper than an LS1 swap.
If you truely take the LS route, an aftermarket tank built for a stock GM pump is the way to go. Install the corvette filter/regulator at the back and you don't need a return line. I did this on a Camaro last year and it was a simple swap. The owner opted for a stainless tank from Rick's.
Oh, and put me first on the engine buyer list !!
I think Stan’s major fuel economy penalty is that little trap door flapper thingy on his hood, he seems to enjoy seeing it open all the time.

SShink · 3K+ Club

dashboard wrote:
I think Stan’s major fuel economy penalty is that little trap door flapper thingy on his hood, he seems to enjoy seeing it open all the time.

Lost in the 60s · President

SShink wrote:
dashboard wrote:
I think Stan’s major fuel economy penalty is that little trap door flapper thingy on his hood, he seems to enjoy seeing it open all the time.

That was my thought too. If he puts an LS engine in, it can stay open all the time because there's no way to utilize it on the intake.

SteveS · Super Poster

For you guys looking into LS engines, here are some more sites that were helpful to me:

Tips for modding an LS1:

http://www.ls1howto.com/

S&P's site lots of builds & Tips:

http://www.hotrodlane.cc/New%20LS%20Links%20Page/LS%20links%20page.html

3 part GM High Tech Performance article on Strokers:

http://www.gmhightechperformance.com/tech/lsx_engine/0608gmhtp_big_cube_ls1_engine_build/index.html

LS1 guide to tuning:

http://ls1tuningguide.com/tuninghelpfiles.php

Cruise control Wiring:

http://www.thirdgen.org/techboard/ltx-lsx/552764-digital-cruise-ltx-lsx.html

-- Edited by SteveS on Thursday 22nd of September 2011 08:40:02 AM

SShink · 3K+ Club

Got my issue of Super Chevy yesterday, and guess what? They are doing a series on the 5.3 LS engine!

I haven't read it yet, but scanned it quickly and noticed that in stock trim (exhaust manifolds and all) their baseline 5.3 had as much HP and Torque as my 402 right out of the box (350 hp/380 ft. lbs.)! And it's almost 100 c.i. smaller and much more efficient too...

The max hp and torque was at a higher rpm (5600) than my 402, but with the right trans it would move the Chevelle right along.

In the article, they make progressive changes with cam, heads, and intake and I think they end up just under 600hp, but need to read it again to check.

Lost in the 60s · President

Stan, do you have the 5.3 in your truck ? I have it mine and for a 6,000 lb vehicle, it gets up and moves...

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
Stan, do you have the 5.3 in your truck ? I have it mine and for a 6,000 lb vehicle, it gets up and moves...

I forgot mention that too... yes, my 2003 Sierra has a 5.3 and it has tons of torque and idles at 500 rpm. I get 17-20 mpg depending on how I drive it, which I think is good for a full size extended cab 4 X 4 truck.

So, now I can go out in the garage and stare at the 5.3 and consider the swap...

Enganeer · Mega Poster

If it's dead quiet and you listen hard enough, you will hear it whisper to you.

You can head over to AAA in Rosemount and pick one up for around $500 or less.

SteveS · Super Poster

If your going iron block, I'd check the price difference between a 5.3 and 6.0. Costs the same to install either one.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Enganeer wrote:
If it's dead quiet and you listen hard enough, you will hear it whisper to you.

You can head over to AAA in Rosemount and pick one up for around $500 or less.

That's what's scaring me... AAA is less than 60 seconds from my house! I'm afraid that the next time I get home a little early, I will feel the force pull me over there to see what they have on hand.

SShink · 3K+ Club

SteveS wrote:
If your going iron block, I'd check the price difference between a 5.3 and 6.0. Costs the same to install either one.

If it's only a couple hundred more, I'd go 6.0. I think they are physically the same other than the 6.0 has a 4" bore?

Enganeer · Mega Poster

6.0L have been going for about double of 5.3L that I have seen. Main reason is there are so many 5.3L available.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Enganeer wrote:
6.0L have been going for about double of 5.3L that I have seen. Main reason is there are so many 5.3L available.

Makes sense. Good 'ole supply and demand at work.

Found this one on AAA website from a 2003 Silverado for $500 with 96K miles (only half broke in )

Part Description:	Engine Assembly 180-180,C50,HC-NA, X-337,ETC
Price:	$500.00
Condition Code:	0.0

Mileage:	96,000
Grade:

Primary Damage Code:
Secondary Damage Code:

In the 100-139K mile range they are $400, and in the 140K+ they are $375.

Looking back to a year ago... I could have bought an entire engine assy for what I spent on fixing the heads on my 402... But at the time, I was all about keeping it stock looking too.

-- Edited by SShink on Thursday 22nd of September 2011 11:17:25 AM

-- Edited by SShink on Thursday 22nd of September 2011 11:21:03 AM

Chris R · 2K+ Club

Brad Wilder did up a 6.0 for his 57 project so you can also tap him for some ideas and opinions on what he did and didnt do since he has real world expierence as well.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Enganeer wrote:
You can head over to AAA in Rosemount and pick one up for around $500 or less.

I emailed AAA and the $500 one is only a long block. No ECU or accessories. I sent them another email asking if they have any complete ones, and the price.

Enganeer · Mega Poster

You got the fever...only one cure...more cowbell!

SShink · 3K+ Club

Enganeer wrote:
You got the fever...only one cure...more cowbell!

Nice SNL reference. Hopefully I'm not Will Ferrell in the shirt that's too short!

bwild70ss396 · Active Member

My 6.0 was $2300 from AAA in Rosemount with all accessories, flywheel, exhaust manifolds and computer. Had 8k miles on it and 352hp stock and big heads on it for easy hp increase. My very mellow cam made 469hp with the tune and headers. I also am watching build of that 5.3 in Chevy mag. Only downside of truck motor is the cast pistons so you cant twist them to high.

-- Edited by bwild70ss396 on Friday 23rd of September 2011 02:32:50 PM

Bowtieman427 · Active Member

Not to add fuel to getting an LS1 there is an article in November Super Chevy P48 "Here Comes Modern Mouse" about 5.3 LS1 upgrades. It will be a 3 part series.

bowtie · Secretary

Not to add any fuel to the fire, but I was going to do a basic overview of the LS engines for the next newsletter......

Bowtieman427 · Active Member

This topic is killing me have not bought anything accept a block for the 383 build this winter, this LS idea is making me rethink the whole idea. LS may be a better soulton for the long haul.

SShink · 3K+ Club

No more thoughts about LS engines and fuel injection. The Chevelle ran great today! I guess I'm !

BB502 · Active Member

Mine runs good in the 50's also.

Lost in the 60s · President

SShink wrote:
No more thoughts about LS engines and fuel injection. The Chevelle ran great today! I guess I'm !
Is this the first time out with the new Edelbrock ? I think you'll like it. No power valve or finicky jet issues. Just drive it....
Big blocks like low temps and high humidity.

dashboard · 2K+ Club

Yep, Stan stopped by this afternoon with that big grin on his face; the Velle is running well.

BB do like cool temperatures; I really enjoy driving mine when it’s cool out.

SShink · 3K+ Club

Lost in the 60s wrote:
SShink wrote:
No more thoughts about LS engines and fuel injection. The Chevelle ran great today! I guess I'm !
Is this the first time out with the new Edelbrock ? I think you'll like it. No power valve or finicky jet issues. Just drive it....
Big blocks like low temps and high humidity.

No, this wasn't the first time with the new Edelbrock, but I had problems with it wanting to die last Sat. when going to Hastings. Started it up today and discovered the idle circuit screws were in too far, and probably the bigger factor was I found the vacuum line for the flapper door had come off the vacuum T, so I had a huge vacuum leak!

That darn flapper door anyway... always seems to get me in trouble!