Paint, truck repair, and outer wheel house, and rear quarter repair on a 66 convertible Questions??
jim larson said
Oct 11, 2019
Well I looked at a 66 convertible that I am thinking of buying yesterday. Two obvious things stick out otherwise all the other body panels and frame look good. Owner bought it from a friend who brought it back from AZ about 25 years ago where it was re-painted. Driven very little in the past 25 years. I wish it had original engine and trans as it was a 327 power glide car. Now has a truck 350 engine with a TH350, maybe posi. Has the original 66 10 bolt rear. PS, Front disc brakes and dual MC. Runs and drive fine, shifts fine, good steering and feel.
Original back seat and door panels, front seat upholstery has been replaced along with front door panels and dash pad, otherwise original carpet and interior. Didn't put the top up; but look good from photos.
Needs trunk repair; but just the lower part above the gas tank. Rear quarters look good, rear dtropoffs look good, along with rear upper truck crossmember and tail panel. Front fenders appear good at the lower rears spots, along with doors, rocker areas, and lower front of rear quarters. Drivers side quarter looks good along with inner and outer wheelhouse with excellent original undercoating. Passenger side quarter looks good at the lower rear and lower front along with the inner wheel house.
Now the main body issue. The passenger outer wheelhouse has been patched with two new pieces kind of replacing the upper part of the outer wheelhouse. The area along the upper part of the wheel well area on the quarter will not hold a weak magnet. I am guessing there is bondo in there. drivers side is fine; but this has had some repair.
I wonder what this came from and how expensive this would be to repair? With the wheelhouse being patched and the bondo present, I am thinking maybe a accident or rust. The magnet sticks fine when testing about 2" above the edge. Maybe just thick bondo. Thinking they may have cut into the outerwheelhouse to push out the quarter panel area above the wheelwell from a mishap This goes on for about 14" along the wheel well following the wheel opening molding.. All the original undercoat looks good in this area except for the part of the outer wheelhouse that is patched.
All the gaps and sight lines look very good, with one exception the truck deck opening on the pass side is to much with the driverside is two small. Can you just move the deck over about 1/16" from right to left easily?
jim larson said
Oct 11, 2019
20 views and no comments?
dashboard said
Oct 11, 2019
Jim, you know more about 66 Chevelles than anyone I know. You could just buy the car put the top down and drive it. Sounds like a very nice car post some pictures.
jim larson said
Oct 11, 2019
Drove it yesterday with the top Dow. A first for me. Felt like I was driving a RTV except it went a lot faster.
i was considering a Red Convet and before I knew it some guy named Kevin bought it. Hope to see you again some day.
-- Edited by jim larson on Friday 11th of October 2019 07:03:57 PM
more ambition than brains said
Oct 11, 2019
Jim, It is unrealistic to try and figure out cost to fix most anything old, until you are too deep to stop. Ask Bruce L. or Mitch for example. I have my own stories too.
Every vehicle has a history, the older the vehicle the more issues. One must be cautious on any purchase. Have seen some "built to sell" horror stories.
My White 66 Elky was a pretty decent car. Needed complete drivetrain redone. I expected to do a frame off, every nut and bolt restoration. Complete strip, fix window areas, rear gate opening pillars minor spots on fenders, doors and 1/4 panels. L/1/4 panel was pretty gruesome but did not really show until stripped.
Car is painted, drivetrain done right, no short cuts, and I truly have no clue how much has really been spent, plus labor. Still being reassembled. Call it poor bookkeeping, but I really don't want to know how much I have spent. Not even sure how many years ago I bought it, Derek might remember. I know he has a lot more kids now.
I agree with Kevin, if you are confident you can buy it and not spend a ton mechanically to drive, go ahead. Do not slide down the slippery slope of dealing with issues listed unless you are prepared to spend big bucks and have someone to do the things you cannot.
In most cases time and material for services rendered is the only fair and realistic way to determine cost of dealing with "old car" issues..
Karl
jim larson said
Oct 11, 2019
I hear you Karl. When I drove the car, it shifted well , kick down worked well, braked well, accelerated well, steering felt good, cornered well, and suspension felt good. Started good, idled a little high, and a little dieseling on shutdown. You can drive as it sits; but I am sure I would get antsy to fix something’s.
no waves or any indication body work other than the wheel well issue. Some moldings appeared to be aftermarket. All original wiring as far as I could see. Some paint issues on hood where it flaked oFriday in spots showing primer. Zero rust issues showing under paint. With documentation showing it was repainted in 95.
dashboard said
Oct 12, 2019
jim larson wrote:
i was considering a Red Convet and before I knew it some guy named Kevin bought it. Hope to see you again some day.
Karls advice is so sound and its based on his years of experience.
About the red convertible. I got it and couldn’t help myself, I began picking at this one little scab, just one little spot that bothered me. Quickly the interior was out, then the drivetrain, then the body came off the frame, then the frame went to blasting and paint while the body went on a rotisserie. Four years later with a new truck pan, floors and blasting the body may be back on the completely restored frame before the snow flys.
If you like the car and your hair blowing in the wind, buy it and drive it. We did that with the Trans Am and love it. There are lots of little projects you can do to satisfy your itch, just limit them to weekend projects.
BLyke said
Oct 12, 2019
"It is unrealistic to try and figure out cost to fix most anything old, until you are too deep to stop. Ask Bruce L. or Mitch for example. I have my own stories too."
Karl knows what he is talking about. I'm also in the "really not exactly how much I have spent", as it is more of an adventure than an investment. However it will be red fairly soon.
-- Edited by BLyke on Sunday 13th of October 2019 08:36:36 AM
jim larson said
Oct 12, 2019
Just trying to get an ideal of the cost to repair the rear quarter panel in the area above the wheel well area. Kind of would like a new project and have always wanted a convertible. I plan to just drive for the first year. I have a complete set up for factory air I could add. Would like to build a L79 engine; but with a hydraulic roller cam, and roller rocker that would run of pump gas. I also have a 306 in the garage I could build. Probably automatic, undecided as to change the TH 350 to the power glide. I also have a 66 12 bolt to go in the rear., It has a rear sway bar and I would add a larger front bar that I have. It has a original 66 tilt wheel, not sure on the PS gear ratio; but when I drove it I didn't notice that you really had to crank the steering wheel to turn.. It has Power front disc brakes and Dual MS with a 4 row original Harrison. Standard ignition set up. A frame off would be dependent upon body condition. Looks like the body mount bolts will come off, appear to be original and not rusted, at least the ones I can see.
jim larson said
Oct 12, 2019
dashboard wrote:
jim larson wrote:
i was considering a Red Convet and before I knew it some guy named Kevin bought it. Hope to see you again some day.
Karls advice is so sound and its based on his years of experience.
About the red convertible. I got it and couldn’t help myself, I began picking at this one little scab, just one little spot that bothered me. Quickly the interior was out, then the drivetrain, then the body came off the frame, then the frame went to blasting and paint while the body went on a rotisserie. Four years later with a new truck pan, floors and blasting the body may be back on the completely restored frame before the snow flys.
If you like the car and your hair blowing in the wind, buy it and drive it. We did that with the Trans Am and love it. There are lots of little projects you can do to satisfy your itch, just limit them to weekend projects.
You'l be driving it next spring for sure. Why don't you throw some photos up on the site?
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 12, 2019
Hope for the best, plan for the worst. The worst would be a complete quarter panel replacement as a result of the one on there being crash damaged or rust out beyond what you would want to save. After installing quarter skins, I would do a full quarter next time, as the result will be better with less time involved with getting an 8 ft weld line straight again. You can patch a wheelhouse easily enough without much evidence in the trunk. Matching the paint could be difficult, could still be lacquer, being painted in 1995, or single stage.
Paying a shop would most likely get you in the 5k range IF that is all it needs.
The trunk lid can be pushed over easily enough by having it open a few inches and pushing from the side, at the front, where the hinges are. They will bend enough to move the lid.
dashboard said
Oct 13, 2019
Jim we are not getting any younger, if you like the wind through your hair feel, buy the vert. Some of us have less and less hair to enjoy the effect.
Right now my project is at the gray sanding dust stage of block sanding and more block sanding. Not much to see in pictures until color is applied and I’m still not sure what color it’s going to be, I’ll post some pictures when there’s color. I still need to decided on a final drivetrain, driving is a long ways off.
jim larson said
Oct 13, 2019
Going for another inspection on Tuesday. As Doris Day said "kay sarahw sarahw, what ever will be will be".
jim larson said
Oct 13, 2019
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Hope for the best, plan for the worst. The worst would be a complete quarter panel replacement as a result of the one on there being crash damaged or rust out beyond what you would want to save. After installing quarter skins, I would do a full quarter next time, as the result will be better with less time involved with getting an 8 ft weld line straight again. You can patch a wheelhouse easily enough without much evidence in the trunk. Matching the paint could be difficult, could still be lacquer, being painted in 1995, or single stage.
Paying a shop would most likely get you in the 5k range IF that is all it needs.
The trunk lid can be pushed over easily enough by having it open a few inches and pushing from the side, at the front, where the hinges are. They will bend enough to move the lid.
Mitch are you saying $5000 just for the quarter panel replacement only. Or for the skin and then a quarter replacement down the line.?
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 14, 2019
jim larson wrote:
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Hope for the best, plan for the worst. The worst would be a complete quarter panel replacement as a result of the one on there being crash damaged or rust out beyond what you would want to save. After installing quarter skins, I would do a full quarter next time, as the result will be better with less time involved with getting an 8 ft weld line straight again. You can patch a wheelhouse easily enough without much evidence in the trunk. Matching the paint could be difficult, could still be lacquer, being painted in 1995, or single stage.
Paying a shop would most likely get you in the 5k range IF that is all it needs.
The trunk lid can be pushed over easily enough by having it open a few inches and pushing from the side, at the front, where the hinges are. They will bend enough to move the lid.
Mitch are you saying $5000 just for the quarter panel replacement only. Or for the skin and then a quarter replacement down the line.?
Q-panel, outer wheel house, other areas of concern they find and the PAINT. PAINT ain't cheap...
Of course, if you do it yourself, it's far less costly, but it's going to take a lot longer to get done too.
If the lines are straight and the car looks good, just enjoy it and drive. Once you tear into them, they become bottomless money and time pits.
more ambition than brains said
Oct 15, 2019
Jim,
With the information provided, Mitch's number is no more than throwing darts at a dart board.
What we ALL agree on is the slippery slope and the certain "project creep"
Unless you want to deal with a multi-year, big buck project that you don't get to drive, do not take it apart or dive into the cosmetics.
Blue ElCamino, apart 23 years, White ElCamino apart about 5 years, took four years to do the Biscayne.
Yes, I have a short attention span, multiple priorities and i get bored easily so that is an extreme however, in all cases each project was greater than expected.
Also life gets in the way.
Karl
-- Edited by more ambition than brains on Tuesday 15th of October 2019 06:54:15 AM
BLyke said
Oct 15, 2019
"Once you tear into them, they become bottomless money and time pits."
"Unless you want to deal with a multi-year, big buck project that you don't get to drive, do not take it apart or dive into the cosmetics."
Truth!!
-- Edited by BLyke on Tuesday 15th of October 2019 04:22:00 PM
dashboard said
Oct 18, 2019
Well did you buy the car?? You just can’t start a thread like this then fall off the edge of the earth. Everyone wants to know it your driving a vert and of course we want pictures..
more ambition than brains said
Oct 18, 2019
Yes, he bought it and went Bird hunting.
We now deserve some pictures!! Karl
dashboard said
Oct 19, 2019
Congrats Jim! Still time to get a couple afternoon cruises in to see those fall colors with the top down. And of course we want pictures!
jim larson said
Oct 20, 2019
Won’t be Home until the 28th. Then ill put up some photos. And lets Hope for an Indian summer.
-- Edited by jim larson on Sunday 20th of October 2019 07:00:12 PM
Well I looked at a 66 convertible that I am thinking of buying yesterday. Two obvious things stick out otherwise all the other body panels and frame look good. Owner bought it from a friend who brought it back from AZ about 25 years ago where it was re-painted. Driven very little in the past 25 years. I wish it had original engine and trans as it was a 327 power glide car. Now has a truck 350 engine with a TH350, maybe posi. Has the original 66 10 bolt rear. PS, Front disc brakes and dual MC. Runs and drive fine, shifts fine, good steering and feel.
Original back seat and door panels, front seat upholstery has been replaced along with front door panels and dash pad, otherwise original carpet and interior. Didn't put the top up; but look good from photos.
Needs trunk repair; but just the lower part above the gas tank. Rear quarters look good, rear dtropoffs look good, along with rear upper truck crossmember and tail panel. Front fenders appear good at the lower rears spots, along with doors, rocker areas, and lower front of rear quarters. Drivers side quarter looks good along with inner and outer wheelhouse with excellent original undercoating. Passenger side quarter looks good at the lower rear and lower front along with the inner wheel house.
Now the main body issue. The passenger outer wheelhouse has been patched with two new pieces kind of replacing the upper part of the outer wheelhouse. The area along the upper part of the wheel well area on the quarter will not hold a weak magnet. I am guessing there is bondo in there. drivers side is fine; but this has had some repair.
I wonder what this came from and how expensive this would be to repair? With the wheelhouse being patched and the bondo present, I am thinking maybe a accident or rust. The magnet sticks fine when testing about 2" above the edge. Maybe just thick bondo. Thinking they may have cut into the outerwheelhouse to push out the quarter panel area above the wheelwell from a mishap This goes on for about 14" along the wheel well following the wheel opening molding.. All the original undercoat looks good in this area except for the part of the outer wheelhouse that is patched.
All the gaps and sight lines look very good, with one exception the truck deck opening on the pass side is to much with the driverside is two small. Can you just move the deck over about 1/16" from right to left easily?
20 views and no comments?
Drove it yesterday with the top Dow. A first for me. Felt like I was driving a RTV except it went a lot faster.
i was considering a Red Convet and before I knew it some guy named Kevin bought it. Hope to see you again some day.
-- Edited by jim larson on Friday 11th of October 2019 07:03:57 PM
Jim,
It is unrealistic to try and figure out cost to fix most anything old, until you are too deep to stop.
Ask Bruce L. or Mitch for example.
I have my own stories too.
Every vehicle has a history, the older the vehicle the more issues.
One must be cautious on any purchase.
Have seen some "built to sell" horror stories.
My White 66 Elky was a pretty decent car.
Needed complete drivetrain redone.
I expected to do a frame off, every nut and bolt restoration.
Complete strip, fix window areas, rear gate opening pillars minor spots on fenders, doors and 1/4 panels.
L/1/4 panel was pretty gruesome but did not really show until stripped.
Car is painted, drivetrain done right, no short cuts, and I truly have no clue how much has really been spent, plus labor.
Still being reassembled.
Call it poor bookkeeping, but I really don't want to know how much I have spent.
Not even sure how many years ago I bought it, Derek might remember.
I know he has a lot more kids now.
I agree with Kevin, if you are confident you can buy it and not spend a ton mechanically to drive, go ahead.
Do not slide down the slippery slope of dealing with issues listed unless you are prepared to spend big bucks and have someone to do the things you cannot.
In most cases time and material for services rendered is the only fair and realistic way to determine cost of dealing with "old car" issues..
Karl
I hear you Karl. When I drove the car, it shifted well , kick down worked well, braked well, accelerated well, steering felt good, cornered well, and suspension felt good. Started good, idled a little high, and a little dieseling on shutdown. You can drive as it sits; but I am sure I would get antsy to fix something’s.
no waves or any indication body work other than the wheel well issue. Some moldings appeared to be aftermarket. All original wiring as far as I could see. Some paint issues on hood where it flaked oFriday in spots showing primer. Zero rust issues showing under paint. With documentation showing it was repainted in 95.
Karls advice is so sound and its based on his years of experience.
About the red convertible. I got it and couldn’t help myself, I began picking at this one little scab, just one little spot that bothered me. Quickly the interior was out, then the drivetrain, then the body came off the frame, then the frame went to blasting and paint while the body went on a rotisserie. Four years later with a new truck pan, floors and blasting the body may be back on the completely restored frame before the snow flys.
If you like the car and your hair blowing in the wind, buy it and drive it. We did that with the Trans Am and love it. There are lots of little projects you can do to satisfy your itch, just limit them to weekend projects.
"It is unrealistic to try and figure out cost to fix most anything old, until you are too deep to stop.
Ask Bruce L. or Mitch for example.
I have my own stories too."
Karl knows what he is talking about.
I'm also in the "really not exactly how much I have spent", as it is more of an adventure than an investment.
However it will be red fairly soon.
-- Edited by BLyke on Sunday 13th of October 2019 08:36:36 AM
Just trying to get an ideal of the cost to repair the rear quarter panel in the area above the wheel well area. Kind of would like a new project and have always wanted a convertible. I plan to just drive for the first year. I have a complete set up for factory air I could add. Would like to build a L79 engine; but with a hydraulic roller cam, and roller rocker that would run of pump gas. I also have a 306 in the garage I could build. Probably automatic, undecided as to change the TH 350 to the power glide. I also have a 66 12 bolt to go in the rear., It has a rear sway bar and I would add a larger front bar that I have. It has a original 66 tilt wheel, not sure on the PS gear ratio; but when I drove it I didn't notice that you really had to crank the steering wheel to turn.. It has Power front disc brakes and Dual MS with a 4 row original Harrison. Standard ignition set up. A frame off would be dependent upon body condition. Looks like the body mount bolts will come off, appear to be original and not rusted, at least the ones I can see.
You'l be driving it next spring for sure. Why don't you throw some photos up on the site?
Paying a shop would most likely get you in the 5k range IF that is all it needs.
The trunk lid can be pushed over easily enough by having it open a few inches and pushing from the side, at the front, where the hinges are. They will bend enough to move the lid.
Right now my project is at the gray sanding dust stage of block sanding and more block sanding. Not much to see in pictures until color is applied and I’m still not sure what color it’s going to be, I’ll post some pictures when there’s color. I still need to decided on a final drivetrain, driving is a long ways off.
Going for another inspection on Tuesday. As Doris Day said "kay sarahw sarahw, what ever will be will be".
Mitch are you saying $5000 just for the quarter panel replacement only. Or for the skin and then a quarter replacement down the line.?
Q-panel, outer wheel house, other areas of concern they find and the PAINT. PAINT ain't cheap...
Of course, if you do it yourself, it's far less costly, but it's going to take a lot longer to get done too.
If the lines are straight and the car looks good, just enjoy it and drive. Once you tear into them, they become bottomless money and time pits.
Jim,
With the information provided, Mitch's number is no more than throwing darts at a dart board.
What we ALL agree on is the slippery slope and the certain "project creep"
Unless you want to deal with a multi-year, big buck project that you don't get to drive, do not take it apart or dive into the cosmetics.
Blue ElCamino, apart 23 years, White ElCamino apart about 5 years, took four years to do the Biscayne.
Yes, I have a short attention span, multiple priorities and i get bored easily so that is an extreme however, in all cases each project was greater than expected.
Also life gets in the way.
Karl
-- Edited by more ambition than brains on Tuesday 15th of October 2019 06:54:15 AM
"Once you tear into them, they become bottomless money and time pits."
"Unless you want to deal with a multi-year, big buck project that you don't get to drive, do not take it apart or dive into the cosmetics."
Truth!!
-- Edited by BLyke on Tuesday 15th of October 2019 04:22:00 PM
Yes, he bought it and went Bird hunting.
We now deserve some pictures!!
Karl
Won’t be Home until the 28th. Then ill put up some photos. And lets Hope for an Indian summer.
-- Edited by jim larson on Sunday 20th of October 2019 07:00:12 PM