After much thought and feeling good about running the 383 for almost 1500 miles, I've decided to sell it and put something less radical in the Chevelle for better AC manners, brake performance, and idle characteristics.
Not like I want to go through pulling another engine again, but thought I'd throw it out there before winter hits. Otherwise, I'll just sit on it until next Spring.
Some in the club know the valve train problems it had, but I do feel confident they are resolved after driving it to KC and back and how strong it runs, so comfortable selling it.
Yes, a cam swap would tame it down, but I'd rather have an engine that was built that way from the beginning.
Let me know if you know anyone interested in taking a look. Club members will get consideration on the price. CL price is $3600 which is much less than I have in it.
Thanks
Bobs_Place said
Oct 3, 2018
Have you thought about a set of Rhoads lifters to tame in down. A friend ran them in several engines, they worked great for him.
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 3, 2018
For what you would lose, it makes more sense to do a cam change. The rest of the engine should be fine for a profile swap and a roller conversion has far less cam related idle and vacuum issues, while retaining the same basic running characteristics as your current flat tappet. If you just plain don't trust the rest of the build, so be it, but since it drove over 1,000 miles with no issues now, I would be talking with Chris about how to get the engine more streetable and yet retain the performance it has. It CAN be done and for around the same as you would lose by selling and starting over.
Larry Lucast said
Oct 3, 2018
If it were my engine, I would put on a set of AFR 195 heads, and a cam of about 175 advertised degrees. The heads will make up for the smaller cam, all for about $2,000. I have those heads and a Comp 274 cam on a 400, and it made 500HP on the dyno.
Derek69SS said
Oct 3, 2018
I agree with Mitch. Cam swap will be cheaper than taking a loss and starting over.
Since everything else is fresh, it should be pretty straight-forward without any reason for project creep.
SShink said
Oct 3, 2018
Thanks everyone.
I'm just not looking to pour any more money into this engine. I already had to put more in it than expected for something that I had hoped to to drop in and drive. I've lost interest in it to be honest, and learned the lesson about chasing a HP number instead of driveability. Don't get me wrong, this thing screams. And for the right guy that wants something like that, it's perfect. I guess I really am getting old and less tolerant of a rumpity rump running engine.
dashboard said
Oct 3, 2018
As we mature the new outlook is, always avoid the tendency of trying to act our age at any time.
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 3, 2018
SShink wrote:
Thanks everyone.
I'm just not looking to pour any more money into this engine. I already had to put more in it than expected for something that I had hoped to to drop in and drive. I've lost interest in it to be honest, and learned the lesson about chasing a HP number instead of driveability. Don't get me wrong, this thing screams. And for the right guy that wants something like that, it's perfect. I guess I really am getting old and less tolerant of a rumpity rump running engine.
Well, maybe it's time to join the LSX crowd and get performance AND driveability...
Derek might have a donor for you by next spring.
SShink said
Oct 4, 2018
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Well, maybe it's time to join the LSX crowd and get performance AND driveability...
Derek might have a donor for you by next spring.
An LS engine is a whole 'nother can of worms. Still not ready to go there due to the install cost/hassle of the engine mounts, oil pan, wire harness, ecu, and on and on...so you're looking at $5K to do it right. The engine is the cheap part in the whole setup from what I understand.
This is what I have my eye on and probably should have done it in the first place since it has all the goodies I'm looking for and still 400+ streetable HP WITH good vacuum, but I was trying to support a local builder and economy: Link to Year One Crate Motor
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 4, 2018
That does seem like a decent engine for the price. The roller cam is what gets the hp/torque similar with better vacuum, and yes, the Dart heads help, BUT to beat a dead horse here, you can do that with your current engine for half the cost...
The LS route can get you even better performance, driveability, fuel mileage AND the advantage of changing the tune/driving characteristics with a computer, for when you change your mind about what you want in 6 months... Keep your eyes open for the parts you need on fb and Craigslist. I see it a lot on fb, where dreamers, like me, buy new parts they never install and then sell for a fraction of what they paid....stand alone computers, oil pans, headers, etc.
I believe the LS will also increase the resale value of your car when you sell it. People want that modern technology far more often than the old school, carburated engines anymore. The cost to go LS could be offset by the resale value.
dashboard said
Oct 4, 2018
Lost in the 60s wrote:
SShink wrote:
Thanks everyone.
I'm just not looking to pour any more money into this engine. I already had to put more in it than expected for something that I had hoped to to drop in and drive. I've lost interest in it to be honest, and learned the lesson about chasing a HP number instead of driveability. Don't get me wrong, this thing screams. And for the right guy that wants something like that, it's perfect. I guess I really am getting old and less tolerant of a rumpity rump running engine.
Well, maybe it's time to join the LSX crowd and get performance AND driveability...
Derek might have a donor for you by next spring.
Shh! I’m watching that.
How far north of 5k will you be when your done playing around with two old school engines and all the associated parts. Starting to sound like government math.
-- Edited by dashboard on Thursday 4th of October 2018 10:02:29 PM
hkgmillette said
Oct 5, 2018
Stan, if you need help pulling it, let me know. I would be willing to come help.
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 5, 2018
hkgmillette wrote:
Stan, if you need help pulling it, let me know. I would be willing to come help.
Yeah, you want to bring it home and put it in that Beetle...
Jon H said
Oct 5, 2018
hkgmillette wrote:
Stan, if you need help pulling it, let me know. I would be willing to come help.
I am available also.
SShink said
Oct 6, 2018
Thanks for the offer to help pull it guys. I'll keep you posted. I have one on the line that's interested, but we'll see if it goes anywhere.
Larry Lucast said
Oct 7, 2018
I too can help
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 7, 2018
If it sells and the person wants it soon, we may as well set up a tech session...we should have it sitting an a lift in a couple hours.
Bobs_Place said
Oct 7, 2018
Stan
I see that there is a core charge on the Year One crate motor? Do you know how much it is?
SShink said
Oct 8, 2018
Bobs_Place wrote:
Stan
I see that there is a core charge on the Year One crate motor? Do you know how much it is?
I haven't been able to determine that yet. You have to go all the way to entering the order to see it. I'll give them a call if I get ready to order one.
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 10, 2018
Were you able to set the hook and reel in the interested party ?
SShink said
Oct 11, 2018
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Were you able to set the hook and reel in the interested party ?
Must have only been in the gill, he slipped off or went to deeper waters. Haven't heard anything from him. He was also asking if I knew of any shops that could yank his old engine and put the new one in, and I said I didn't know any. So, didn't sound very handy with a wrench. It wasn't something I wanted to get into to help him.
Lost in the 60s said
Oct 11, 2018
SShink wrote:
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Were you able to set the hook and reel in the interested party ?
Must have only been in the gill, he slipped off or went to deeper waters. Haven't heard anything from him. He was also asking if I knew of any shops that could yank his old engine and put the new one in, and I said I didn't know any. So, didn't sound very handy with a wrench. It wasn't something I wanted to get into to help him.
Hmmmm.....might an income opportunity there and a core for Chris... $400 ??
SShink said
Dec 1, 2018
SOLD as a long block!
Got pretty much what I wanted out of it to replace it with the Year One Crate 350.
BLyke said
Dec 1, 2018
Glad to see you got it sold.
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 1, 2018
SShink wrote:
SOLD as a long block!
Got pretty much what I wanted out of it to replace it with the Year One Crate 350.
So, is the Year One a long block to use your heads on ?
I'll be supplying Chris with a core 350 soon. He could build you exactly what that Year One engine is as a long block and use the parts you kept....gotta be a cost savings there.
-- Edited by Lost in the 60s on Saturday 1st of December 2018 04:35:25 PM
Chris S said
Dec 1, 2018
When is that coming out Stan??
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 1, 2018
Chris S wrote:
When is that coming out Stan??
Tech session ? Or is it already on the hook ?
SShink said
Dec 2, 2018
Mitch, I sold it with everything except for the carb, disty, starter, fuel pump, and front brackets/accessories, and the YR1 engine comes with the heads, so no need to mess with those.
Chris, I'm going to get the car moved to the center of the garage to have more room, and will start disconnecting things next weekend. The buyer is in no rush, but wants it sooner than later. Otherwise, we're both on vacation the week after Christmas, so that might be when it gets pulled unless I get really ambitious before then.
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 2, 2018
SShink wrote:
Mitch, I sold it with everything except for the carb, disty, starter, fuel pump, and front brackets/accessories, and the YR1 engine comes with the heads, so no need to mess with those.
Chris, I'm going to get the car moved to the center of the garage to have more room, and will start disconnecting things next weekend. The buyer is in no rush, but wants it sooner than later. Otherwise, we're both on vacation the week after Christmas, so that might be when it gets pulled unless I get really ambitious before then.
Duh, I HATE being old...brain fart on long block versus short block...
Order that new engine tomorrow, have it delivered here, drive the car down and we'll do the complete swap the week after Christmas...you can drive it home again and new owner can pick up his prize here.
Larry Lucast said
Dec 2, 2018
I would be glad to help, wherever you do it.
AK said
Dec 5, 2018
I'm definitely interested in helping
SShink said
Dec 6, 2018
Thanks everyone. I'm not sure what my full plan is yet. It depends if I start tearing into it this weekend. Turns out the buyer wants it sooner than later, so I need to get moving on it.
I called Year One, and they're running anywhere from 3-6 weeks for delivery at this popular Christmas time of the year, so I hate to pull the 383 at someone else's place then have the car sitting there for weeks waiting for the YR1 engine.
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 6, 2018
We can pull it up on the trailer and park it in the hut outside. It would be out of the weather.
Have you determined the core charge ? That could be enough to go with a "local" rebuilder. I just checked the GM crate engines and theirs is $5200 to compete with the YR1 engine...probably not an option...
SShink said
Dec 7, 2018
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Have you determined the core charge ? That could be enough to go with a "local" rebuilder. I just checked the GM crate engines and theirs is $5200 to compete with the YR1 engine...probably not an option...
I confirmed with YR1 that there isn't a core charge.
The note on their website is related to a core charge 'return charge', so I guess if someone does ship a core back, there's a charge. The sales guy on the phone didn't know why the note was even on the website, and was going to talk to someone about removing it.
Besides, now I'm skittish about going with a 'local' builder after the last experience.
-- Edited by SShink on Friday 7th of December 2018 10:34:54 AM
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 7, 2018
I was making a reference to "our" resident, local builder...
Without any specs on their "proprietary grind" camshaft, are you certain this isn't going to be too aggressive again ? 400 hp out of a 350 is getting up there, but the roller cam may tame it some. Will they give you specs to see if you will, truly, like it before purchasing ?
Almost feels like buying another lottery ticket without firm information to make an informed decision...
67ss said
Dec 7, 2018
There is no way I could duplicate that motor for the price they are selling it at.
According to YR1 this motor makes 12“ of vacuum at an idle, which is way better then the 7-8 he has now. I think this motor will be a good fit to the rest of the way his car is setup.
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 7, 2018
67ss wrote:
There is no way I could duplicate that motor for the price they are selling it at.
According to YR1 this motor makes 12“ of vacuum at an idle, which is way better then the 7-8 he has now. I think this motor will be a good fit to the rest of the way his car is setup.
I saw the vacuum rating but with being uncertain of the actual specs and a "need to know" guy, I would have to ask them...
Stan could be a test vehicle for other future engine swaps.
more ambition than brains said
Dec 8, 2018
Hoping to have the ElCamino motor (327) back before Bow Tie Brunch. If not, leaves opportunity for a different motor drop in, hint, hint.
Original 327 from White Elky getting "gentle" freshening.
Nothing too crazy.
If done by Brunch we can attach transmission, run the brake lines on front crossmember, drop in.
No body on frame yet easy, peasy.
Or, Stan, if you want a warm place with multiple supervisors we can do on January 19th.
Betcha Mitch could help with transport.
Karl
SShink said
Dec 8, 2018
Thanks again for all the offers to help. Santa's helper that lives about 2 miles from me stopped over this morning and 3 hours later the motor is out and I'm back in the CAC for the 2nd time this year. Thanks again Chris S.!
Well, finally got some good car guy Karma going today when I placed the order with Year One, and saved $200 plus I still have $100 store credit to buy more parts!!!
YR1 is having a gift certificate special if you buy one (in either $100, $500, or $1000 values) you get an additional 10% to use towards a purchase, so I worked with their sales guy to get the crate 350 for $3000 instead of $3200 plus $100 leftover for other purchases. I bought three $1000 gift certificates that got me to $3300 total value (equals three $1100 gift certs), and applied that towards the engine leaving the $100 for more parts.
Here's a link to their gift certificate deal if anyone's interested: Link to 10% OFF YR1
Gotta say, the guy there has been great to work with, and even emailed me back at 8 p.m. his time just now from his Ipad. His last name is King, so I think he's related to the owner Kevin King. Not sure of the relationship, but there has to be one there. Anyway, he was all over this today trying to help me out and he followed through on everything he said he would. It's been a long time since I ordered anything from them as they were usually higher in price, but this was a sweet deal. Maybe it's a sign that things turned around for me on the crate engine front.
Lost in the 60s said
Dec 10, 2018
Sounds like a great deal and a fun time. Did he give any estimate of delivery time ? It could be fun to "throw" this in at Karl's...
SShink said
Dec 11, 2018
Lost in the 60s wrote:
Sounds like a great deal and a fun time. Did he give any estimate of delivery time ? It could be fun to "throw" this in at Karl's...
The order is officially placed and set up to be delivered to my door in 'about 4 weeks or so'.
Thanks for the idea to throw it in at Karl's, but I have some engine bay cleaning/painting/detailing to do first that I didn't do on the last yank and replace activity. So, it will likely be March or so before it warms up enough to have it ready for the new heartbeat. But then again, this may motivate me to install the garage heater over the Christmas break and then I'll have heat to work in.
After much thought and feeling good about running the 383 for almost 1500 miles, I've decided to sell it and put something less radical in the Chevelle for better AC manners, brake performance, and idle characteristics.
Link to 383 CL Ad
Not like I want to go through pulling another engine again, but thought I'd throw it out there before winter hits. Otherwise, I'll just sit on it until next Spring.
Some in the club know the valve train problems it had, but I do feel confident they are resolved after driving it to KC and back and how strong it runs, so comfortable selling it.
Yes, a cam swap would tame it down, but I'd rather have an engine that was built that way from the beginning.
Let me know if you know anyone interested in taking a look. Club members will get consideration on the price. CL price is $3600 which is much less than I have in it.
Thanks
Have you thought about a set of Rhoads lifters to tame in down. A friend ran them in several engines, they worked great for him.
Since everything else is fresh, it should be pretty straight-forward without any reason for project creep.
Thanks everyone.
I'm just not looking to pour any more money into this engine. I already had to put more in it than expected for something that I had hoped to to drop in and drive. I've lost interest in it to be honest, and learned the lesson about chasing a HP number instead of driveability. Don't get me wrong, this thing screams. And for the right guy that wants something like that, it's perfect. I guess I really am getting old and less tolerant of a rumpity rump running engine.
Well, maybe it's time to join the LSX crowd and get performance AND driveability...
Derek might have a donor for you by next spring.
An LS engine is a whole 'nother can of worms. Still not ready to go there due to the install cost/hassle of the engine mounts, oil pan, wire harness, ecu, and on and on...so you're looking at $5K to do it right. The engine is the cheap part in the whole setup from what I understand.
This is what I have my eye on and probably should have done it in the first place since it has all the goodies I'm looking for and still 400+ streetable HP WITH good vacuum, but I was trying to support a local builder and economy: Link to Year One Crate Motor
That does seem like a decent engine for the price. The roller cam is what gets the hp/torque similar with better vacuum, and yes, the Dart heads help, BUT to beat a dead horse here, you can do that with your current engine for half the cost...
The LS route can get you even better performance, driveability, fuel mileage AND the advantage of changing the tune/driving characteristics with a computer, for when you change your mind about what you want in 6 months...
I believe the LS will also increase the resale value of your car when you sell it. People want that modern technology far more often than the old school, carburated engines anymore. The cost to go LS could be offset by the resale value.
Shh! I’m watching that.
How far north of 5k will you be when your done playing around with two old school engines and all the associated parts. Starting to sound like government math.
-- Edited by dashboard on Thursday 4th of October 2018 10:02:29 PM
Yeah, you want to bring it home and put it in that Beetle...
I am available also.
Thanks for the offer to help pull it guys. I'll keep you posted. I have one on the line that's interested, but we'll see if it goes anywhere.
Stan
I see that there is a core charge on the Year One crate motor? Do you know how much it is?
I haven't been able to determine that yet. You have to go all the way to entering the order to see it. I'll give them a call if I get ready to order one.
Were you able to set the hook and reel in the interested party ?
Must have only been in the gill, he slipped off or went to deeper waters. Haven't heard anything from him. He was also asking if I knew of any shops that could yank his old engine and put the new one in, and I said I didn't know any. So, didn't sound very handy with a wrench. It wasn't something I wanted to get into to help him.
Hmmmm.....might an income opportunity there and a core for Chris... $400 ??
SOLD as a long block!
Got pretty much what I wanted out of it to replace it with the Year One Crate 350.
So, is the Year One a long block to use your heads on ?
I'll be supplying Chris with a core 350 soon. He could build you exactly what that Year One engine is as a long block and use the parts you kept....gotta be a cost savings there.
-- Edited by Lost in the 60s on Saturday 1st of December 2018 04:35:25 PM
When is that coming out Stan??
Tech session ? Or is it already on the hook ?
Mitch, I sold it with everything except for the carb, disty, starter, fuel pump, and front brackets/accessories, and the YR1 engine comes with the heads, so no need to mess with those.
Chris, I'm going to get the car moved to the center of the garage to have more room, and will start disconnecting things next weekend. The buyer is in no rush, but wants it sooner than later. Otherwise, we're both on vacation the week after Christmas, so that might be when it gets pulled unless I get really ambitious before then.
Duh, I HATE being old...brain fart on long block versus short block...
Order that new engine tomorrow, have it delivered here, drive the car down and we'll do the complete swap the week after Christmas...you can drive it home again and new owner can pick up his prize here.
Thanks everyone. I'm not sure what my full plan is yet. It depends if I start tearing into it this weekend. Turns out the buyer wants it sooner than later, so I need to get moving on it.
I called Year One, and they're running anywhere from 3-6 weeks for delivery at this popular Christmas time of the year, so I hate to pull the 383 at someone else's place then have the car sitting there for weeks waiting for the YR1 engine.
Have you determined the core charge ? That could be enough to go with a "local" rebuilder. I just checked the GM crate engines and theirs is $5200 to compete with the YR1 engine...probably not an option...
I confirmed with YR1 that there isn't a core charge.
The note on their website is related to a core charge 'return charge', so I guess if someone does ship a core back, there's a charge. The sales guy on the phone didn't know why the note was even on the website, and was going to talk to someone about removing it.
Besides, now I'm skittish about going with a 'local' builder after the last experience.
-- Edited by SShink on Friday 7th of December 2018 10:34:54 AM
I was making a reference to "our" resident, local builder...
Without any specs on their "proprietary grind" camshaft, are you certain this isn't going to be too aggressive again ? 400 hp out of a 350 is getting up there, but the roller cam may tame it some. Will they give you specs to see if you will, truly, like it before purchasing ?
Almost feels like buying another lottery ticket without firm information to make an informed decision...
There is no way I could duplicate that motor for the price they are selling it at.
According to YR1 this motor makes 12“ of vacuum at an idle, which is way better then the 7-8 he has now. I think this motor will be a good fit to the rest of the way his car is setup.
Stan could be a test vehicle for other future engine swaps.
Hoping to have the ElCamino motor (327) back before Bow Tie Brunch.
If not, leaves opportunity for a different motor drop in, hint, hint.
Original 327 from White Elky getting "gentle" freshening.
Nothing too crazy.
If done by Brunch we can attach transmission, run the brake lines on front crossmember, drop in.
No body on frame yet easy, peasy.
Or, Stan, if you want a warm place with multiple supervisors we can do on January 19th.
Betcha Mitch could help with transport.
Karl
Thanks again for all the offers to help. Santa's helper that lives about 2 miles from me stopped over this morning and 3 hours later the motor is out and I'm back in the CAC for the 2nd time this year. Thanks again Chris S.!
The 383 goes to the new owner in the morning.
Well, finally got some good car guy Karma going today when I placed the order with Year One, and saved $200 plus I still have $100 store credit to buy more parts!!!
YR1 is having a gift certificate special if you buy one (in either $100, $500, or $1000 values) you get an additional 10% to use towards a purchase, so I worked with their sales guy to get the crate 350 for $3000 instead of $3200 plus $100 leftover for other purchases. I bought three $1000 gift certificates that got me to $3300 total value (equals three $1100 gift certs), and applied that towards the engine leaving the $100 for more parts.
Here's a link to their gift certificate deal if anyone's interested: Link to 10% OFF YR1
Gotta say, the guy there has been great to work with, and even emailed me back at 8 p.m. his time just now from his Ipad. His last name is King, so I think he's related to the owner Kevin King. Not sure of the relationship, but there has to be one there. Anyway, he was all over this today trying to help me out and he followed through on everything he said he would. It's been a long time since I ordered anything from them as they were usually higher in price, but this was a sweet deal. Maybe it's a sign that things turned around for me on the crate engine front.
Sounds like a great deal and a fun time. Did he give any estimate of delivery time ? It could be fun to "throw" this in at Karl's...
The order is officially placed and set up to be delivered to my door in 'about 4 weeks or so'.
Thanks for the idea to throw it in at Karl's, but I have some engine bay cleaning/painting/detailing to do first that I didn't do on the last yank and replace activity. So, it will likely be March or so before it warms up enough to have it ready for the new heartbeat. But then again, this may motivate me to install the garage heater over the Christmas break and then I'll have heat to work in.