Next to a hotrod, a boat is the 2nd biggest money-sucking-black-hole in the universe...
The last few times out with the Glastron, I noticed a growling noise coming from the back. It changed pitch with RPM, and with steering input. Nuts... probably the gimbal bearing. On top of that, the rear bench seat finally "let go". Johnny climbed in after tubing, stepped down and CRUNCH!!... the plywood base gave up the ghost.
We hauled it home so I could work on it at my leisure, and have tools/resources at hand.
Well, I pulled the outdrive off, and was greeted by about a quart of water pouring out of the drive bellows... NOT GOOD! Looking up through the hole it was a mess of flung-off grease and rust. Sticking my fingers in the bearing and turning it, I was treated to the feel of crispy/crunchy rollers in the bearing. Great... a relatively simple bearing change has turned into a bellows job.
Ebay is a wonderful thing, and was able to get a full transom service kit (all 3 rubber bellows, the bearing, clamps, sealant goo, coolant hose, and all 4 of the "Special Mercruiser Tools XYZ123, 4, 5, & 6") needed to remove the gimbal/bell housing, pull the bearing, drive the new one in, and seat the new bellows retainer for under $400. (I shopped around and got quotes for a gimbal bearing & bellows job, and they were between $1000 & $1300!)
Ok... the job (mechanically speaking) isn't much more difficult than changing a rear axle seal on our cars. Well within the capabilities of most of us. That said, CRAM a 1" shaft, 2 U-joints, a shift cable, a 2.5" exhaust port, a 3/4" hose, and 3 rubber accordion bellows into an area 5"x9"!!! (Marine mechanics earn every dime charged. Working on this stuff is a TOTAL P.I.T.A. !!) Well, after several hours of tinkering, multiple streams of cuss-words, references to my Mercruiser manuals, and a few YouTube vids the drive assembly is back on the boat. Hooked up the water-muffs and fired it up - No growly noises, leaks, and the prop spins both ways. I think I'm good.
Having to re-do the seat base was a blessing in disguise. The biggest PITA with working on a boat is access to the engine. There is flat NO ROOM!! You are leaning over the seats/bulkhead, crap is in your way, friggindesignersneverthoughtabouthavingtoFIXanythingputcrapinyourway, etc... So I had to remove the plastic-molded seat base/cooler assembly & bulkhead anyway to replace the plywood base - which gave me un-incumbered access to the engine.
There was enough left of the original seat base (after removing 246,987 staples holding the upholstery on) to use it as a template. So, a few hours later a sheet of 3/4" plywood was carved into a new base. Got rid of some leftover primer/sealer, and re-upholstered the new wood... Then, I looked at the top lid/sun-deck... . Yup.. It was failing too. Oh well, I have a 1/2 sheet of plywood anyway. There was only 358,876 staples holding this upholstery on, so why not!
So. The boat is mechanically back to snuff, the rear seat should last another 20 years, and I can now figure out why "Blackie" blew a radiator hose off, dumped 4 gallons of coolant all over the place, and nearly left me stranded on a run to the hardware store...
dashboard said
Sep 12, 2013
Seems like you’ve been refining you’re woodworking skills lately. Maybe you should do a test run on one of the local lakes before the repo back to the cabin.
That’s unlike Blackie to leave you shipwrecked. Have you tried the heat shrink hose clamps?
I used them on the Buick and will never use a metal clamp again.
If you need a mate on local sea trials let me know.
67ss said
Sep 12, 2013
Your boat rant brings up something I have been thinking about lately. Having the mechanical aptitude and abilities that most of in the club have is it a blessing or a curse really. I look at the page long list of projects I have written down most my own and some my nieghbors since they know I or we have the ability to fix most things. Just when I think I am catching up on stuff 5 more things seem to appear out of no where. I wonder would it be nice to only have to come home and mow the lawn and clean the house and to only set foot in the garage to park the car in it. Granted having to call some one to come and fix this or that can be a daunting task in itself and to write the check for said fix can be mind boggling but some days I wonder if it would be worth it? Maybe I just need a vacation, but than again I would probably have to fix something while on said vacation.
John D said
Sep 12, 2013
The Blackie thing was more than likely my lack of attention. I've never gone back and re-tweaked the hose clams since re-assembly, and I was romping on it during our week of 90+ deg days. It just got hot, burped, and found the weak link. (Those heat-shrink clamps look slicko!)
Yup, my basic carpentry skills & tool kit have been getting a workout. Then regurgitating the upholstery stuff I did doing Car-Fi 25 years ago! What's stupid is that Glastron didn't use P.T., treated, or even primed/painted plywood!! Just raw cheap-azz 5-ply junk.
I popped for 7-ply birch veneer, and sealed, primed and painted it. It should last longer than the boat.
Using bare wood is the same as our classics never having paint inside....they didn't want that boat to last for 20-30 years, they wanted you to buy a new one in 5-7 years. My Glastron is a '79 but sat in my Dad's garage for 13 of those years.
Hopefully Blackie didn't pop a head gasket and overpressure the coolant system...
You could maybe benefit from a vacation, as long as it doesn't go like ours to Deadwood...
bowtie said
Sep 12, 2013
67ss wrote:
Your boat rant brings up something I have been thinking about lately. Having the mechanical aptitude and abilities that most of in the club have is it a blessing or a curse really. I look at the page long list of projects I have written down most my own and some my nieghbors since they know I or we have the ability to fix most things. Just when I think I am catching up on stuff 5 more things seem to appear out of no where. I wonder would it be nice to only have to come home and mow the lawn and clean the house and to only set foot in the garage to park the car in it. Granted having to call some one to come and fix this or that can be a daunting task in itself and to write the check for said fix can be mind boggling but some days I wonder if it would be worth it? Maybe I just need a vacation, but than again I would probably have to fix something while on said vacation.
You're already training your replacement........
As someone who has some sort of deficiency that separates the mechanical book smarts and prevents it from travelling down to the hands, I can say I would much rather be in your place. I'm learning how to better deal with it but sometimes it IS much easier to just write a check. Did I mention I screwed up painting my old fridge so I've had to completely re-sand it and will be re-painting it tomorrow. She's undisturbed water-straight now though.
John D said
Sep 12, 2013
As a side note...
I now have the "special" tools required to service a gimbal bearing on a Mercruiser stern drive:
Bearing Puller
Bearing Installer
Alignment Shaft
Bellhousing bolt adapter/removal socket
Bellow retaining ring installer
Available for rent (standard garage currency - Nordeast - and a small $$ donation to the 40-watt garage)
SteveS said
Sep 12, 2013
67ss wrote:
Your boat rant brings up something I have been thinking about lately. Having the mechanical aptitude and abilities that most of in the club have is it a blessing or a curse really. I look at the page long list of projects I have written down most my own and some my nieghbors since they know I or we have the ability to fix most things. Just when I think I am catching up on stuff 5 more things seem to appear out of no where. I wonder would it be nice to only have to come home and mow the lawn and clean the house and to only set foot in the garage to park the car in it. Granted having to call some one to come and fix this or that can be a daunting task in itself and to write the check for said fix can be mind boggling but some days I wonder if it would be worth it? Maybe I just need a vacation, but than again I would probably have to fix something while on said vacation.
You hit the nail on the head Chris. I like to help out, but right now one neighbor has a late 90's Buick that has coolant disappearing, another needs brakes in their Explorer when ever I get the chance, and my Tahoe is way over due for an oil change. The other day I was driving by a quick lube place and thought it might be worth $30 to go sit in their waiting room and have one more thing off my list.
Lost in the 60s said
Sep 12, 2013
John D wrote:
As a side note...
I now have the "special" tools required to service a gimbal bearing on a Mercruiser stern drive: Bearing Puller Bearing Installer Alignment Shaft Bellhousing bolt adapter/removal socket Bellow retaining ring installer
Available for rent (standard garage currency - Nordeast - and a small $$ donation to the 40-watt garage)
Nice to know the tools are around. At the current rate of useage, 2 years without seeing water, it will be a while before I would need them. I SHOULD pull the shaft out for "periodic" maintenance of the u-joints.
Derek69SS said
Sep 12, 2013
SteveS wrote:
67ss wrote:
Your boat rant brings up something I have been thinking about lately. Having the mechanical aptitude and abilities that most of in the club have is it a blessing or a curse really. I look at the page long list of projects I have written down most my own and some my nieghbors since they know I or we have the ability to fix most things. Just when I think I am catching up on stuff 5 more things seem to appear out of no where. I wonder would it be nice to only have to come home and mow the lawn and clean the house and to only set foot in the garage to park the car in it. Granted having to call some one to come and fix this or that can be a daunting task in itself and to write the check for said fix can be mind boggling but some days I wonder if it would be worth it? Maybe I just need a vacation, but than again I would probably have to fix something while on said vacation.
You hit the nail on the head Chris. I like to help out, but right now one neighbor has a late 90's Buick that has coolant disappearing, another needs brakes in their Explorer when ever I get the chance, and my Tahoe is way over due for an oil change. The other day I was driving by a quick lube place and thought it might be worth $30 to go sit in their waiting room and have one more thing off my list.
I just sent my neighbor home with his '57 Bel Air yesterday, telling him it would be at least 2 weeks before I could fix his brakes... whoever installed (and modified) his disc brake setup was a talented fabricator, but a lousy engineer.
67ss said
Sep 12, 2013
SteveS wrote:
You hit the nail on the head Chris. I like to help out, but right now one neighbor has a late 90's Buick that has coolant disappearing, another needs brakes in their Explorer when ever I get the chance, and my Tahoe is way over due for an oil change. The other day I was driving by a quick lube place and thought it might be worth $30 to go sit in their waiting room and have one more thing off my list.
The worse part is that way were are makes it hard for us to allow someone else to do the work in fear that you will probably have to go back and do it over because they did not do it right or the way you would have done it yourself.
P.S. Sorry John I did not mean to overtake your thread, I should have started a new one.
John D said
Sep 12, 2013
No hi-jacking involved here... you've beaten me to the punch on explaining why I do all my own repairs whenever possible. I just don't trust someone that I haven't witnessed/helped them working on something, or have seen their work. There are just too many "hacks" out there.
I don't think a shop would've taken the time I did to painstakingly scrub off all the old bellows adhesive, clean the transom housing, fit, check, re-fit the bellows (dry), climb in & out of the boat 50 times turning the motor mount jack-screws 1/8th turn (getting the drive coupler & gimbal bearing aligned "just perfect"), adjusting the trim senders (so the rams extend to the exact 20-7/8" called for), etc, etc, etc... Working on book time for a job they'll get the job done, but not under my qualifications of "right".
I take a lot of pride in the work I can do. On the inverse of that, I've got no-one to blame if something I've done fails. That's why I'm so irked that "Blackie" blew his guts all over the road last week... but, it's my fault - I didn't keep up on checking and maintenance.
Yeah, I'm fussy... but I just run with the mantra "Do you have time to do it right, or time to do it over?".
(Not too long ago at Stan's Cave I stopped by to help with the engine re-assembly of Chevelle #876-or-something. We were going to fit the intake on the engine, and he had prepped everything but needed some "support". I distinctly remember a friendly jibe about "I hope it's "John Clean""... It wasn't! It's nice to hear that some of my advise & techniques have rubbed off)
John D said
Sep 13, 2013
"At the current rate of useage, 2 years without seeing water, it will be a while before I would need them. I SHOULD pull the shaft out for "periodic" maintenance of the u-joints."
What's nuts is that "non-use" or not checking over time is just as detrimental.
I'll go on a limb here and say that when the engine/transom/drive was installed on my boat they took pains to ensure the drive coupler/gimbal housing/shaft was aligned & concentric. Now, turn the clock 15 or so years. 500 lbs of engine on rubber mounts and things are going to compress and get a "set".
My outdrive slid out/off with NO effort. Six bolts, a tug/yank and it was in my hands. Putting the drive aside, and just for S&G's I slid the alignment tool (exactly like a clutch input shaft tool) into the hole and THUD - it didn't slide into the coupler splines!!
My engine assy. had settled nearly 1/8" on the mounts!! It took nearly 3 full turns of the engine mount "screw jacks" to get the engine back into alignment with the transom/gimbal bearing for the alignment shaft to slip/slide in like it's supposed to (no resistance, slide in and use two fingers worth of torque to turn). So, even without a "failure" the outdrive was mis-aligned and seriously stressing the rubber-encased coupler and gimbal bearing.
Next to a hotrod, a boat is the 2nd biggest money-sucking-black-hole in the universe...
The last few times out with the Glastron, I noticed a growling noise coming from the back. It changed pitch with RPM, and with steering input. Nuts... probably the gimbal bearing. On top of that, the rear bench seat finally "let go". Johnny climbed in after tubing, stepped down and CRUNCH!!... the plywood base gave up the ghost.
We hauled it home so I could work on it at my leisure, and have tools/resources at hand.
Well, I pulled the outdrive off, and was greeted by about a quart of water pouring out of the drive bellows... NOT GOOD! Looking up through the hole it was a mess of flung-off grease and rust. Sticking my fingers in the bearing and turning it, I was treated to the feel of crispy/crunchy rollers in the bearing. Great... a relatively simple bearing change has turned into a bellows job.
Ebay is a wonderful thing, and was able to get a full transom service kit (all 3 rubber bellows, the bearing, clamps, sealant goo, coolant hose, and all 4 of the "Special Mercruiser Tools XYZ123, 4, 5, & 6") needed to remove the gimbal/bell housing, pull the bearing, drive the new one in, and seat the new bellows retainer for under $400. (I shopped around and got quotes for a gimbal bearing & bellows job, and they were between $1000 & $1300!)
Ok... the job (mechanically speaking) isn't much more difficult than changing a rear axle seal on our cars. Well within the capabilities of most of us. That said, CRAM a 1" shaft, 2 U-joints, a shift cable, a 2.5" exhaust port, a 3/4" hose, and 3 rubber accordion bellows into an area 5"x9"!!! (Marine mechanics earn every dime charged. Working on this stuff is a TOTAL P.I.T.A. !!) Well, after several hours of tinkering, multiple streams of cuss-words, references to my Mercruiser manuals, and a few YouTube vids the drive assembly is back on the boat. Hooked up the water-muffs and fired it up - No growly noises, leaks, and the prop spins both ways. I think I'm good.
Having to re-do the seat base was a blessing in disguise. The biggest PITA with working on a boat is access to the engine. There is flat NO ROOM!! You are leaning over the seats/bulkhead, crap is in your way, friggindesignersneverthoughtabouthavingtoFIXanythingputcrapinyourway, etc... So I had to remove the plastic-molded seat base/cooler assembly & bulkhead anyway to replace the plywood base - which gave me un-incumbered access to the engine.
There was enough left of the original seat base (after removing 246,987 staples holding the upholstery on) to use it as a template. So, a few hours later a sheet of 3/4" plywood was carved into a new base. Got rid of some leftover primer/sealer, and re-upholstered the new wood... Then, I looked at the top lid/sun-deck...
. Yup.. It was failing too. Oh well, I have a 1/2 sheet of plywood anyway. There was only 358,876 staples holding this upholstery on, so why not!
So. The boat is mechanically back to snuff, the rear seat should last another 20 years, and I can now figure out why "Blackie" blew a radiator hose off, dumped 4 gallons of coolant all over the place, and nearly left me stranded on a run to the hardware store...
That’s unlike Blackie to leave you shipwrecked. Have you tried the heat shrink hose clamps?
www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/GATU/32960/N0189.oap
I used them on the Buick and will never use a metal clamp again.
If you need a mate on local sea trials let me know.
Your boat rant brings up something I have been thinking about lately. Having the mechanical aptitude and abilities that most of in the club have is it a blessing or a curse really. I look at the page long list of projects I have written down most my own and some my nieghbors since they know I or we have the ability to fix most things. Just when I think I am catching up on stuff 5 more things seem to appear out of no where. I wonder would it be nice to only have to come home and mow the lawn and clean the house and to only set foot in the garage to park the car in it. Granted having to call some one to come and fix this or that can be a daunting task in itself and to write the check for said fix can be mind boggling but some days I wonder if it would be worth it? Maybe I just need a vacation, but than again I would probably have to fix something while on said vacation.
The Blackie thing was more than likely my lack of attention. I've never gone back and re-tweaked the hose clams since re-assembly, and I was romping on it during our week of 90+ deg days. It just got hot, burped, and found the weak link.
(Those heat-shrink clamps look slicko!)
Yup, my basic carpentry skills & tool kit have been getting a workout. Then regurgitating the upholstery stuff I did doing Car-Fi 25 years ago! What's stupid is that Glastron didn't use P.T., treated, or even primed/painted plywood!! Just raw cheap-azz 5-ply junk.
I popped for 7-ply birch veneer, and sealed, primed and painted it. It should last longer than the boat.
Using bare wood is the same as our classics never having paint inside....they didn't want that boat to last for 20-30 years, they wanted you to buy a new one in 5-7 years. My Glastron is a '79 but sat in my Dad's garage for 13 of those years.
Hopefully Blackie didn't pop a head gasket and overpressure the coolant system...
You could maybe benefit from a vacation, as long as it doesn't go like ours to Deadwood...
You're already training your replacement........
As someone who has some sort of deficiency that separates the mechanical book smarts and prevents it from travelling down to the hands, I can say I would much rather be in your place. I'm learning how to better deal with it but sometimes it IS much easier to just write a check. Did I mention I screwed up painting my old fridge so I've had to completely re-sand it and will be re-painting it tomorrow. She's undisturbed water-straight now though.
I now have the "special" tools required to service a gimbal bearing on a Mercruiser stern drive:
Bearing Puller
Bearing Installer
Alignment Shaft
Bellhousing bolt adapter/removal socket
Bellow retaining ring installer
Available for rent (standard garage currency - Nordeast - and a small $$ donation to the 40-watt garage)
You hit the nail on the head Chris. I like to help out, but right now one neighbor has a late 90's Buick that has coolant disappearing, another needs brakes in their Explorer when ever I get the chance, and my Tahoe is way over due for an oil change. The other day I was driving by a quick lube place and thought it might be worth $30 to go sit in their waiting room and have one more thing off my list.
Nice to know the tools are around. At the current rate of useage, 2 years without seeing water, it will be a while before I would need them. I SHOULD pull the shaft out for "periodic" maintenance of the u-joints.
I just sent my neighbor home with his '57 Bel Air yesterday, telling him it would be at least 2 weeks before I could fix his brakes... whoever installed (and modified) his disc brake setup was a talented fabricator, but a lousy engineer.
The worse part is that way were are makes it hard for us to allow someone else to do the work in fear that you will probably have to go back and do it over because they did not do it right or the way you would have done it yourself.
P.S. Sorry John I did not mean to overtake your thread, I should have started a new one.
I don't think a shop would've taken the time I did to painstakingly scrub off all the old bellows adhesive, clean the transom housing, fit, check, re-fit the bellows (dry), climb in & out of the boat 50 times turning the motor mount jack-screws 1/8th turn (getting the drive coupler & gimbal bearing aligned "just perfect"), adjusting the trim senders (so the rams extend to the exact 20-7/8" called for), etc, etc, etc... Working on book time for a job they'll get the job done, but not under my qualifications of "right".
I take a lot of pride in the work I can do. On the inverse of that, I've got no-one to blame if something I've done fails. That's why I'm so irked that "Blackie" blew his guts all over the road last week... but, it's my fault - I didn't keep up on checking and maintenance.
Yeah, I'm fussy... but I just run with the mantra "Do you have time to do it right, or time to do it over?".
(Not too long ago at Stan's Cave I stopped by to help with the engine re-assembly of Chevelle #876-or-something. We were going to fit the intake on the engine, and he had prepped everything but needed some "support". I distinctly remember a friendly jibe about "I hope it's "John Clean""... It wasn't! It's nice to hear that some of my advise & techniques have rubbed off)
What's nuts is that "non-use" or not checking over time is just as detrimental.
I'll go on a limb here and say that when the engine/transom/drive was installed on my boat they took pains to ensure the drive coupler/gimbal housing/shaft was aligned & concentric. Now, turn the clock 15 or so years. 500 lbs of engine on rubber mounts and things are going to compress and get a "set".
My outdrive slid out/off with NO effort. Six bolts, a tug/yank and it was in my hands. Putting the drive aside, and just for S&G's I slid the alignment tool (exactly like a clutch input shaft tool) into the hole and THUD - it didn't slide into the coupler splines!!
My engine assy. had settled nearly 1/8" on the mounts!! It took nearly 3 full turns of the engine mount "screw jacks" to get the engine back into alignment with the transom/gimbal bearing for the alignment shaft to slip/slide in like it's supposed to (no resistance, slide in and use two fingers worth of torque to turn). So, even without a "failure" the outdrive was mis-aligned and seriously stressing the rubber-encased coupler and gimbal bearing.