I would think you should be close to that. The 290hp GM crate engine cam is close in specs but you have much better heads on your engine. I am guessing 300-325 horse.
Chris R said
Apr 13, 2011
I was also going to guess about 325 horses as well.
SShink said
Apr 13, 2011
Where are you taking it to dyno?
69SSConv said
Apr 13, 2011
Taking it to Wheeler's in Blaine.
69SSConv said
Apr 14, 2011
Not a good day at the Dyno, no ones fault but mineI had my lower timing gear in wrong position and it was off by 120 deg. Good news is we only spun it over by the starter, never did fire it up. Bad news, bent some pushrods, and some exhaust valves. Brought it home and pulled the heads, to have new exhaust valves put in. Be a couple weeks before I can get it back to the Dyno.
Lost in the 60s said
Apr 14, 2011
Ouch..............that hurts. Sorry to hear it. Might want to have the pistons checked for cracks in the dome too. Pushrods bend pretty easy but valve stems don't. That had to be a hard impact on aluminum.
69SSConv said
Apr 14, 2011
It does not look like there was any significant damage to the pistons, a very slight scuff to the surface on the outside edge of the dish. Impact was on the very edge of the exhaust valve less than 1/8" surface area that impacted the piston? There is no noticable bend in the valves, we pressurized the cylinders with air and had a very slight airflow through the exhaust port.
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 14th of April 2011 04:49:38 PM
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 14th of April 2011 04:50:40 PM
Lost in the 60s said
Apr 14, 2011
Probably OK.
SShink said
Apr 14, 2011
Sorry to hear that Loren. Hazards of the hobby I guess... I can personally vouch for destroying a functional 700R4 trans in an '88 Camaro just by trying to put a shift kit in myself about 10 years ago... I 'paid' for an education on that one!
Chris R said
Apr 14, 2011
Thats too bad Loren. Sounds like minor damage but make sure they check to make sure the valve guide and cylinder head pocket didnt get any damage near that valve.
bowtie said
Apr 14, 2011
That sucks. At least you know the cause and can track the damage.
69SSConv said
Apr 27, 2011
Back to the Dyno this afternoon. I am sure I will have much better results this time. I will provide details tonight.
Enganeer said
Apr 27, 2011
Good luck!
Chris R said
Apr 27, 2011
Good luck. Your probably watching it run on the dyno as I type this.
69SSConv said
Apr 27, 2011
Update.
Dyno day went well, had a minor hiccup but OK all in all went well. Used the shop carb, engine started immediately and ran it through the 20 minute break-in period without a hitch. Then the engine just died. Turns out that my rotor in my GM HEI distributor came apart? Ran down to Auto Zone to get a new rotor, installed and nothing? At that point we dropped in a shop distributor and made some pulls on the motor.
Drum roll................
With the shop Holley 750
Peak hp 319hp
Peak torque 391
switched to my Edelbrock 1406 (unknown condition carb, came with motor)
Peak hp 303
Peak torque 379?
Forgot my sheets on the counter at Wheelers, will get from Jeff later this week.
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Wednesday 27th of April 2011 03:57:14 PM
Winston Wolf said
Apr 27, 2011
How high were the peaks, and when did it start to fall off?
Chris R said
Apr 27, 2011
Looks like you lost over 15 HP by swapping the Holley for the Edelbrock. Sounds like it was a good day.
Lost in the 60s said
Apr 27, 2011
That's a decent cruiser engine.....
You'll never notice 15hp/lbs ft torque difference in a street car.....
69SSConv said
Apr 27, 2011
Don't remember where the peaks were, when I get the printouts, that I left there I will post.
69SSConv said
Apr 27, 2011
Think the module might be the problem with the GM HEI distributor? No apparent broken wires, grounds all seem to be OK? Any ideas?
Lost in the 60s said
Apr 27, 2011
If it's an older one with vacuum advance, the tiny wires break right where they come out of the pick up coil from flexing. They can be hard to see if the plastic insulation is still holding them together.
69SSConv said
Apr 27, 2011
I am also wondering if there is too much play in the distributor? When the rotor came apart it appeared as though the contact hit inside the cap and tore the contact off the rotor? Inside the cap looked fine, no unusual edges, etc. Think I might just need to pick up a new distributor?
Winston Wolf said
Apr 28, 2011
For the price of a new dist, I would just pick one up and avoid all the headaches. Also, if that Edelbrock is jetted/tuned correctly, you should lose nothing to a Holley at the HP level you are at. They are good carbs and work well.
Bungy L-76 said
Apr 28, 2011
Congrats Loren! Sounds like it was a good day overall. I agree that you shouldn't lose 15hp from the carb swap. The dyno sheets should tell you if the Edelbrock was running lean or rich and you can swap in some metering rods to get back the 15hp. Maybe need a rebuild kit in it also.
69SSConv said
Apr 28, 2011
I plan on going through the carb, as I did not before the Dyno, linkage was a little sticky, so I am sure if I go through and clean it up it should give back some of the lost hp.
I am also planning to ditch the distributor and install a MSD Streetfire or something along that line.
Lost in the 60s said
Apr 28, 2011
69SSConv wrote:I am also planning to ditch the distributor and install a MSD Streetfire or something along that line.
Good plan. I was hoping you weren't going to get one of those $59 Chinese pieces of junk off ebay...
SShink said
Apr 28, 2011
Loren, if I could rebuild my Edelbrock and have it perform almost identical to the dyno shop Holley that had been VERY tricked out, you can do it too! This was the first Edelbrock carb I had ever rebuilt, and it turned out great.
Agree with Winston and Bungie that there shouldn't be that much of a HP drop by changing carbs if they are both functioning properly. IMO
69SSConv said
Apr 28, 2011
Got my Dyno sheets today. (Holley Shop Carb)
Peak torque is at 3900 rpm = 391.0
Peak hp is at 4900 rpm = 318.5
AFR Ratio @ 4900 = 12.4
Edelbrock, which has not been rebuilt and linkage is sticky, not sure secondary's even opened up all the way??
Peak Torque at 4000 rpm = 373.0
Peak hp at 4900 rpm = 303.1
AFR Ratio at 4900 = 11.8
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 28th of April 2011 07:37:44 PM
SShink said
Apr 29, 2011
Loren, that's a torquey engine for what I would call a 'warmed over' small block! That should scoot that Camaro right along!
It's torque is similar to how my mostly stock 407 BBC dyno'd other than being at a higher rpm (mine was 382 ft. lbs. at 4200 if I remember right).
Lost in the 60s said
Apr 29, 2011
Yes, that's a great street engine with a 5000 rpm shift point. Once you have the Edelbrock working correctly, it will match the Holley and be less finicky with temp changes........and THIS from a lifelong Holley fan....
Winston Wolf said
Apr 29, 2011
69SSConv wrote:
Got my Dyno sheets today. (Holley Shop Carb)
Peak torque is at 3900 rpm = 391.0
Peak hp is at 4900 rpm = 318.5
AFR Ratio @ 4900 = 12.4
Edelbrock, which has not been rebuilt and linkage is sticky, not sure secondary's even opened up all the way??
Peak Torque at 4000 rpm = 373.0
Peak hp at 4900 rpm = 303.1
AFR Ratio at 4900 = 11.8
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 28th of April 2011 07:37:44 PM
I would clean up the Performer carb, go one stage leaner in the primaries, and run it. It it drives well then, leave it alone. Be sure to tune the idle mixture screws with a vacuum gauge in drive, and you should be good to go.
Scott Parkhurst said
Apr 29, 2011
Congrats Loren!
Bowtieman427 said
Apr 29, 2011
69SSConv wrote:
Got my Dyno sheets today. (Holley Shop Carb)
Peak torque is at 3900 rpm = 391.0
Peak hp is at 4900 rpm = 318.5
AFR Ratio @ 4900 = 12.4
Edelbrock, which has not been rebuilt and linkage is sticky, not sure secondary's even opened up all the way??
Peak Torque at 4000 rpm = 373.0
Peak hp at 4900 rpm = 303.1
AFR Ratio at 4900 = 11.8
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 28th of April 2011 07:37:44 PM
With an AFR of 11.8 the Edelbroock is running to rich @ 4900 RPM. Not sure if in primary or sencodary section. Your Dyno sheet may have AFR printed out at different RPM points. May see it running right on then start going rich or it may be rich all the time or at certian points lean and rich. You should study your Dyno sheet and make carb ajustments against it.
Mechanial or vacuum advance ? Vacuum will only open to what demand is put on it.
69SSConv said
Apr 29, 2011
It is a vacuum advance. I ordered some smaller jets for it today and rebuild kit. As part of the rebuild I will adjust the jets to bring things more in line.
Tomorrow I am taking the engine for my father/son project to Wheeler's to have it dyno'd. Hoping it will put out at least 300hp.
It is 1980 vintage 350 block bored .030, built with:
Speed Pro Hypereutectic Pistons w/.180 Dish (to keep compression down for 87 oct, should be 8.75-9:00:1)
Vortec Heads (thank you Bryan)
Edelbrock Performer Intake
Lunati Cam & Lifter kit - 60101K 213/219, .454/.468
Comp roller tip rockers, & guide plates
Balanced assembly
Edelbrock 600 cfm carb.
Do you think I will get to 300hp?
I would think you should be close to that. The 290hp GM crate engine cam is close in specs but you have much better heads on your engine. I am guessing 300-325 horse.
I was also going to guess about 325 horses as well.
Where are you taking it to dyno?
Not a good day at the Dyno, no ones fault but mine
I had my lower timing gear in wrong position and it was off by 120 deg
. Good news is we only spun it over by the starter, never did fire it up. Bad news, bent some pushrods, and some exhaust valves. Brought it home and pulled the heads, to have new exhaust valves put in. Be a couple weeks before I can get it back to the Dyno.
It does not look like there was any significant damage to the pistons, a very slight scuff to the surface on the outside edge of the dish. Impact was on the very edge of the exhaust valve less than 1/8" surface area that impacted the piston? There is no noticable bend in the valves, we pressurized the cylinders with air and had a very slight airflow through the exhaust port.
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 14th of April 2011 04:49:38 PM
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 14th of April 2011 04:50:40 PM
Probably OK.
Sorry to hear that Loren. Hazards of the hobby I guess... I can personally vouch for destroying a functional 700R4 trans in an '88 Camaro just by trying to put a shift kit in myself about 10 years ago... I 'paid' for an education on that one!
Thats too bad Loren. Sounds like minor damage but make sure they check to make sure the valve guide and cylinder head pocket didnt get any damage near that valve.
Back to the Dyno this afternoon. I am sure I will have much better results this time. I will provide details tonight.
Good luck!
Good luck. Your probably watching it run on the dyno as I type this.
Update.
Dyno day went well, had a minor hiccup but OK all in all went well. Used the shop carb, engine started immediately and ran it through the 20 minute break-in period without a hitch. Then the engine just died
. Turns out that my rotor in my GM HEI distributor came apart? Ran down to Auto Zone to get a new rotor, installed and nothing? At that point we dropped in a shop distributor and made some pulls on the motor.
Drum roll................
With the shop Holley 750
Peak hp 319hp
Peak torque 391
switched to my Edelbrock 1406 (unknown condition carb, came with motor)
Peak hp 303
Peak torque 379?
Forgot my sheets on the counter at Wheelers, will get from Jeff later this week.
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Wednesday 27th of April 2011 03:57:14 PM
How high were the peaks, and when did it start to fall off?
Looks like you lost over 15 HP by swapping the Holley for the Edelbrock. Sounds like it was a good day.
That's a decent cruiser engine.....
You'll never notice 15hp/lbs ft torque difference in a street car.....
If it's an older one with vacuum advance, the tiny wires break right where they come out of the pick up coil from flexing. They can be hard to see if the plastic insulation is still holding them together.
For the price of a new dist, I would just pick one up and avoid all the headaches. Also, if that Edelbrock is jetted/tuned correctly, you should lose nothing to a Holley at the HP level you are at. They are good carbs and work well.
Congrats Loren! Sounds like it was a good day overall. I agree that you shouldn't lose 15hp from the carb swap. The dyno sheets should tell you if the Edelbrock was running lean or rich and you can swap in some metering rods to get back the 15hp. Maybe need a rebuild kit in it also.
I plan on going through the carb, as I did not before the Dyno, linkage was a little sticky, so I am sure if I go through and clean it up it should give back some of the lost hp.
I am also planning to ditch the distributor and install a MSD Streetfire or something along that line.
Loren, if I could rebuild my Edelbrock and have it perform almost identical to the dyno shop Holley that had been VERY tricked out, you can do it too! This was the first Edelbrock carb I had ever rebuilt, and it turned out great.
Agree with Winston and Bungie that there shouldn't be that much of a HP drop by changing carbs if they are both functioning properly. IMO
Got my Dyno sheets today. (Holley Shop Carb)
Peak torque is at 3900 rpm = 391.0
Peak hp is at 4900 rpm = 318.5
AFR Ratio @ 4900 = 12.4
Edelbrock, which has not been rebuilt and linkage is sticky, not sure secondary's even opened up all the way??
Peak Torque at 4000 rpm = 373.0
Peak hp at 4900 rpm = 303.1
AFR Ratio at 4900 = 11.8
-- Edited by 69SSConv on Thursday 28th of April 2011 07:37:44 PM
Loren, that's a torquey engine for what I would call a 'warmed over' small block! That should scoot that Camaro right along!
It's torque is similar to how my mostly stock 407 BBC dyno'd other than being at a higher rpm (mine was 382 ft. lbs. at 4200 if I remember right).
Yes, that's a great street engine with a 5000 rpm shift point. Once you have the Edelbrock working correctly, it will match the Holley and be less finicky with temp changes........and THIS from a lifelong Holley fan....
I would clean up the Performer carb, go one stage leaner in the primaries, and run it. It it drives well then, leave it alone. Be sure to tune the idle mixture screws with a vacuum gauge in drive, and you should be good to go.
With an AFR of 11.8 the Edelbroock is running to rich @ 4900 RPM. Not sure if in primary or sencodary section. Your Dyno sheet may have AFR printed out at different RPM points. May see it running right on then start going rich or it may be rich all the time or at certian points lean and rich. You should study your Dyno sheet and make carb ajustments against it.
Mechanial or vacuum advance ? Vacuum will only open to what demand is put on it.