In a thread started by Stan S, he talked about welding the pickup to the oil pump, so it wouldn't fall out, it looks like a press fit.  Any opinions?  thanks. Jim

They are a press fit, and a pretty tight one. There is a "special" tool/jig available to drive the pickup in straight & true. I think the whole welding/brazing thing started either when: - Someone bugger'd up their pickup tube (using the wrong method/tool) and had no recourse but to weld it in place - Severe duty use such as off-road or true racing where they wanted ZERO chance of it ever shifting, or getting whacked out of line due to impact. With 300 zillion pickup tubes in use out there, IMO it's unnecessary IF the tube is installed correctly.

John D wrote:

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They are a press fit, and a pretty tight one. There is a "special" tool/jig available to drive the pickup in straight & true.

I think the whole welding/brazing thing started either when:
- Someone bugger'd up their pickup tube (using the wrong method/tool) and had no recourse but to weld it in place
- Severe duty use such as off-road or true racing where they wanted ZERO chance of it ever shifting, or getting whacked out of line due to impact.

With 300 zillion pickup tubes in use out there, IMO it's unnecessary IF the tube is installed correctly.

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Thanks John.  With my engine apart for other reasons, just wanted to check.  It appears to be in there quite soid.

 

One thing you should check with the pan unbolted and the pump in place is the clearance between the pickup and the bottom of the pan.

This is easy to do with:

Small Heavy-duty ziplock/freezer bag
Circle of pop/beer case cardboard
Golf-ball+ lump of play-doh or modelling clay

- Cut a disc of cardboard the diameter of the pickup screen.
- Put the bag over the pickup (and cardboard), and stretch taut, tape in place.
- Smush the playdoh into a disc about 1/2" thick, and lay on the pickup screen.
- Set the pan in place, and gently press down on the sump area, until the pan touches the gaskets.
- Lift off the pan, and look at the playdoh. You've made an impression of the pickup screen contact/clearance.

If I remember right, there should be about 5/16 to 3/8" clearance, and the pickup should be parallel to the bottom of the pan. Adjust the pickup as needed by gently tweaking. Retest as needed.

I agree with john there is no real reason to weld a pickup tube on. If you are worried about it falling out there are companies that make a bracket that loops around the tube and attaches to two of the bolts holding the pump cover. Granted this keeps it from falling out but not from moving out of position to the bottom of the pan.

-- Edited by 67ss on Monday 3rd of January 2011 02:28:34 PM

I have rebuilt 2 engines for others that a pickup screen they installed fell out and the engine starved for oil on acceleration and hard braking.
I like the bracket idea that Chris brings up as it eliminates the welding, but I have welded several tubes once the clearance to the pan has been set. All it takes is a couple tacks from a Mig and it's done. I wouldn't put an engine together without something to hold that screen, other than friction. Once a tube has been pressed into a pump, they never seem to go back tight and I don't trust that they will stay.

I would never reuse a pickup tube, I could see where those could fall out easily.  But I have seen more welded ones fall out that were not welded correctly then news ones pressed in that fall out. Here is a picture of the retainer I was talking about.

Who sells these? Sounds like Stan S needs one as one of his photo's that he posted shows the tube almost falling out.? New post on questions now that I took the timing cover off and removed the cam a little.

  I've had two pickups fall out resulting in loss of oil pressure, both small blocks one was factory.

  Had a girlfriend that was using my 68, 327 Camaro she told me one night, "I think something is wrong with your Camaro."  I ask why she thought so,she said "every time I come to a stop the oil pressure gauge gos to zero, the oil light comes on and the engine makes lots of noise"  I asked her when this start? She said "about two months ago"  Yes, she was blond. 

So they can and do fall out.  John is correct the numbers falling out are small, I've had two, maybe I should have bought a lottery ticket.  A small tac weld or a little JB Weld is cheap insurance.   

Jegs or summit has them I borrowed the picture from the jegs website.

Please be careful. We had a guy weld one on a 502 crate engine he bought from us. did a p/p job and splattered everywhere. One piece broke off and got stuck in the oil pump.

This is the first I have heard of anyone having problems with a welded tube. I would suggest the bracket if thats the case.

Ill never use a press fit tube in a pump again... Two little tacj welds wont hurt anything..

as for me.. Two words... "Melling Select"

I thought I tig welded the last one on.

A friend of mine loaned me the book 'How to Hotrod Big-Block Chevys' published in 1971 and it says... "The pickup tube must be brazed or tack welded to the pump body.  A pickup tube shaking loose and falling out of the pump is NOT uncommon.  The bottom of the pickup should be spaced about 3/8 inch from the bottom of the pan."

I know I've heard about doing this for the past 20 years or so at least.  I'm going to have it done to mine. 

As you know, it's a bit of a drive up here, but if you want, I can weld it for you.

Lost in the 60s wrote:

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As you know, it's a bit of a drive up here, but if you want, I can weld it for you.

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Thanks Mitch.  I need to get up there again and check out your work and give you a hand (if you need it...).

Or, I may have John D. weld it some night in the next week or so for me (I work about 15 min. from where he lives).

 

It'll take longer to set up the welder than to actually do it. Two zaps with the MIG and it's done.
Once you've got the parts, and have the pickup seated/aligned/installed just give me a buzz. We can meet up after work.

The main thing to remember is when a pickup tube was new it was at a dimension of say .402. After install it is reduced to a dimension of .400 now the additional .002 may not appear much but on stamped steel it is enough to not be the tightest press fit again. Option B is clean degrease and red or green Locktight. Still you have a chance for failure if all is not right.

Pioneer also makes/sells those brackets, and they're available at most parts stores.

jim larson wrote:

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Who sells these? Sounds like Stan S needs one as one of his photo's that he posted shows the tube almost falling out.? New post on questions now that I took the timing cover off and removed the cam a little.

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I checked the pickup tube and it's nice and tight.  There is about 1/8" gap between it and the pump body as seen in the pic, but it is tight.  I couldn't move it by hand.

I'm still going to have John D. put a couple of tack welds on it for insurance.